Gallery of Lights
Lanterns/Fixtures => Vintage => Topic started by: joe_347V on November 16, 2011, 10:56:45 PM
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I'm sure some clamshells have failed before.............................
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When did I say the ballasts will never fail? Of course everything will stop working eventually...............
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When did I say the ballasts will never fail? Of course everything will stop working eventually...............
You implied it over here......................
Those ballasts will keep running and running.....
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i guess you could interperet it that way, but i was implying that the remote ballasts will last longer than internally ballast fixtures..... They will keep running and running a lot longer than the internally ballasted ones.
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Depends on the fixture design too some integral ballasted lumes keep the ballast well coolled while others allow to ballast to overheat. Remember ballast life is often affected by heat.
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Yep. Another example is that a 250w HPS medium fixture will LIKELY outlast a small 250w HPS fixture given that neither are defective.
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Well 250w HPS was originally used in medium lumes first.
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250w wasn't designed for small lumes liek you said. It's in a small sized lume to make it cheaper. :( >:( :8) I liek the older HPS fixtures. They seem to be far more reliable than themodern stuff. Same goes for the lamps.
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The new low/no mercury HPS lamps also light in a more orange colour compared to the older lamps which were more golden yellow. Also the ignitors in older fixtures were arguably better built.
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the newer ignitors have fewer pulses in them. The capacitors are also horrible in soem of the newer CWA ballasts. :(
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Fewer Pulses?, I guess you mean the expected lifespan is shorter. :P
Caps in CWA ballasts seem to be hit or miss, I have a few that were decent but I've heard caps in newer ballasts that fail prematurely.
Also I split and moved the last few posts since it has NOTHING to do with rare earth elements. :P
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yes. They're designed to give a lower number of pulses to start the lamp, meaning thet die sooner. the GE caps seem to be a problem since they stopped making them in their factories.
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Lower no. pulses == lower expected lifespan. :P
GE caps I believe are outsourced now, but they should gotten a better company to make them but remember everything now is done based on cost and profit. :8)
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yeah. The R2s seem to be the ones with the bad caps. NGrid doesn't change out <PLUG IN> ingitors, so GE still makes plenty ofprofits from them since NGrid buys GE fixtures and only GE fixtures.
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A lot of places don't change ignitors nowadays....
It's too bad they didn't standardise ignitors like they did with fluorescent starters.
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I thought all ignitors did have the same receptacle. :-\
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They don't and plus ignitors aren't even electrically compatible between ballast brands.
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Don't all ignitors of the same lamp wattage deliver the same voltage to the lamp though? (Except 100V vs 55v)
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No the three wire ignitors are designed for use on their specified ballasts only since they use part of ballast to step up the pulse. Since they are designed as a matched pair ignitor strengths may vary and you'll risk putting a weak ignitor with a weak ballast....etc. It's usually not good for the ballast or ignitor to mismatch them.
Two wire ignitors are a different story though, as long as you disable the original ignitor two wire ignitors can be mixed.
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what's more common: 2 or 3 wire?
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3 Wire by a lot very few ignitors are two wire.
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The Cooper HPS light Niall is getting has a red wire, white, and blue wire ignitor...
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All of my HPS ballasts use three wire ignitors.
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That light was my only HPS light. However, my PSMH wall mount light has a 3 wire ignitor as well.
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My PSMH ballasts use three wire ignitors too.
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My ignitor fixtures are off brand ignitors. (They're enclosed in a tubular plastic case and have the wires popping out the top.
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My ignitors generally match the brand of the ballast in this case: Advance, Venture, Sola, and the ever popular Caster cube ignitors. ;D
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Cooper uses the cube style too. o_O
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The Caster ones are sorta infamous here for the quality (or lack of). :P
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I've heard some bad things about Caster's quality......
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........Hence the infamous lack of quality................. :P
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I wonder what the best yardblaster company is quality wise. None seem to be exeptional quality, but one is probably better than the others. The MV blasters seem good. MV parts are so simple and inexpensive upfront, so the quality was a bit better than the HPS and MH ones of today.
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The older MV ones didn't have a fail prone ignitor inside them too and you could always swap the lamp and PC with a better one.
I guess the older yardblasters were better built, I think I've seen a pic of a older one with a heftier ballast inside.
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The older blasters used ballasts close to the quality of NEMA head ballasts from what I've seen.
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They also came with Westy lifeguards too. :P
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Lifeguard lamps??? :o :D :D :D :D
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Here's an example, (http://www.lighting-gallery.net/gallery/displayimage.php?pos=-38867) feel free to comment on that page. :P
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wow. I'm sure today's NEMAs aren't as good as they were either....
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Yeah but I guess they're still better than the yardlights we have today.
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Yeah. NGrid doesn't use NEMAs here. They're in love with the M-250R2. Sometimes a new M-250R2 just pops up where there was no light before or a M-250R2 replaces a different model that's still working great. Ideally, a company would want all their lights to ne identical, but companies seem to discontinue models so fastly, it's next to impossible.
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I think utilities or mine at least like to find the cheapest lume to put on because if they wanted the lights to be identical they would be still installing OV 15s and OV 25s.
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Sometimes a comapny will give you a discount if you only purchse their products. NGrid uses almost ALL GE products. It woulnd'nt surprise me that GE owns them. (they don't of course).
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Sometimes a comapny will give you a discount if you only purchse their products. NGrid uses almost ALL GE products. It woulnd'nt surprise me that GE owns them. (they don't of course).
It also depend whether or not they use contractors, my area uses contractors and the replacement lume often depends on what's on the truck that day.
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That's true. If different contractors do different areas the lights will differ. Are the lights owned by your municipality or by the contractors?
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I believe by the municipality but they're serviced by the utility.
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So they're bought by the municipality, installed by the contracters, and maintained by the utility co? :o Wow. The utility co here does everything. that's why RI has no money and wny NGrid has money flying out of their safes. :8)
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Except for Toronto, all the streetlights there are owned/serviced/installed/maintained by the utility.
MTO lighting is owned by the MTO and serviced by contractors.
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i understand now. ;D RIDOT owns the lights and poles, etc, but they're serviced and maintained by either them, contractors, or NGrid. I'm not sure on that one. When I report lights burned out, the ones that have PCs i have to contact NGrid. The newer relay ones and older highmasts are RIDOT thought I think.
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I don't think MTO has their own bucket trucks anymore. :(
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RIDOT might.....
UPDATE: they do: (http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3074/3061049055_e778eb8bfa.jpg)
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Interesting.
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Funny thing is that I've never seen ONE of these in my 13 years in RI. :P
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Did you check the yards?
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i have been to the RIDOT warehouse when i was 8, but i was into signs then. They even showed me a pile of streetlights!!!! :o I believe there was M-250R2, OVM, M-400R2, and OVS, but there may have been more or less. I wish i was into lights when i went there. There were poles in the back (davits to be exact) and probably new lights too, which i took no notice of. i did get a No parking sign and over 2 dozen mini signs as well as learn how they make a sign. it was a very cool sight when I was 8. i wish i could go back for the lights. The place is pretty close too! Not to bike to though. The only way to get there from my house is to go the highway. plus, there's a huge hill that'd be fun to go down on a bike, but you'll drop dead biking up it. :o here's the RIDOT Maintenance Division, which i visited. (http://maps.google.com/maps?q=jefferson+blvd+maps&hl=en&ll=41.744529,-71.439961&spn=0.001889,0.007306&oe=UTF-8&safe=active&hq=jefferson+blvd&hnear=Cranston,+Providence,+Rhode+Island&t=h&vpsrc=6&fll=41.7444,-71.440197&fspn=0.001889,0.007306&z=18)
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Cool, I wonder if they will still recognize you. :P
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They might recognize my mom, but me? Nah. :P right here is where you can see traffic lights and what appears to be cobraheads. :o :D (http://maps.google.com/maps?q=jefferson+blvd+maps&hl=en&ll=41.744736,-71.440783&spn=0.000472,0.001827&oe=UTF-8&safe=active&hq=jefferson+blvd&hnear=Cranston,+Providence,+Rhode+Island&t=h&vpsrc=6&fll=41.744767,-71.440523&fspn=0.000472,0.001827&z=20)
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Nice, here's (http://maps.google.ca/maps?hl=en&ll=43.742261,-79.529479&spn=0.000951,0.002621&t=h&z=19&vpsrc=6) the MTO's yard, you can see some signs lying on the ground.
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Anyways, one of the M-250r2s that replaced a 113 last week is cyclign already! :o :8) >:( there was nothign wrong with the 113 either. The 113 probably has been lighting the origional lamp in it since Narragansett Electric installed it in the 90's.
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Oh sure like you've ever been on topic after this post. :8)
Yeah. NGrid doesn't use NEMAs here. They're in love with the M-250R2. Sometimes a new M-250R2 just pops up where there was no light before or a M-250R2 replaces a different model that's still working great. Ideally, a company would want all their lights to ne identical, but companies seem to discontinue models so fastly, it's next to impossible.
Ugh, I never really got why utilities replace lumes that still work. :8)
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I do get it either. It's not liek the ignitorwas bad (which isn't and excuse to replace it anyways) it was workign fine one night and there was an R2 the next night.
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My area likes to replace the fixture when ever they change out the pole even if nothing was wrong with the old one. :8)
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At least they don't do that here. This was just a surprise thing that doesn't happen very often....
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They used to keep the old fixture but apparently someone had the bright idea to change them out starting last year. :8)
They also change the arms out too but they use these 6 footers instead of the a 8 foot one so the new pole sticks out like a sore thumb. :8)
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When they replace an arm here, which is only if needed, it's a 6 foot upsweep. Those don't mix well with 10ft trusses. :8)
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I've noticed they only change the stuff if the light is on it's own pole, the lights on utility poles often get reused.
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A lot of places don't change ignitors nowadays....
It's too bad they didn't standardise ignitors like they did with fluorescent starters.
Actually my area does! Even sometimes the fixture original fixture wasn't meant to be changed...sometimes it gets a new ignitor socket and ignitor during fix....if enough time..
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Actually my area does! Even sometimes the fixture original fixture wasn't meant to be changed...sometimes it gets a new ignitor socket and ignitor during fix....if enough time..
Interesting, I hope more areas stop junking lumes just because the ignitor blew or worse just because the lamp was cycling.
That's good that not all the lights are scrapped. :)
Yeah otherwise those B2217s would have been scrapped.
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Wow. I don't know why NG doesn't replace PLUG-IN ignitors, but they don't. Not even in the GEs that they've installed. :(
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The Powerlites (at least the later ones) have plugin ignitors and my area also replaces them.
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That's good. The only thing with an external igniter is the lamp cycles, and it's one more part to fail. :8)
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It's kinda of like fluorescent starters but ignitors are a lot more expensive.
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Yeah. Starters are also all standardized as well. All share a common base for the same wattages and have the same operating characteristics, which make them cross-changeable (if that word even makes sense)
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They should have done the same for ignitors (or at least for the two wire ones which are interchangeable for a given wattage).
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Hmm. Of all things, I wonder why NEMA doesn't require a standardized ingitor and plug-in receptacle ???
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I think it's because the three wire ignitors weren't really as compatible as the starters and that since HID lights are supposed to be serviced by electrician they thought that they could easily splice a new ignitor in unlike fluorescents which are sometimes serviced by homeowners and a more user friendly system would be better.
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True, but I'd say not all electricians see in details how ballasts work. If it wasn't because I am a lighting enthusiast, I wouldn't even know how to wire an ignitor! We've recently seen HID lights at school and nothing's been told about the workings. We saw how they looked like and what are their performances.